Buildings and political attacks
by M. Stewart
I see in today’s Review a story about East Liverpool Board of Education member Janice Martin’s objection to a special meeting called by board president Gary Bonnell, but it’s not the details of that issue that interest me. What does interest me is the idea that any school building—in this case, Westgate—should be abandoned.
I guess I have more of a European sense about buildings—that is, if you have a good building, put your money into maintenance and repair rather than new construction. Wouldn’t it be great, for example, if the old Central School were still there and used. That building was one of the most impressive ever built in the city, yet it was abandoned and eventually knocked over without ceremony. Only after it was down did people get nostalgic and decide to build a little “replica” on the same spot.
The East Liverpool School District later abandoned the building that now houses part of Kent State University—a perfectly good building that’s currently in better condition than it was when it was new. And what did we get for it? A hideous modern building up on the hill constructed so poorly that it’s already falling apart. I won’t even get into the damage done to the city by the district removing all the students from the downtown.
When it comes to buildings, I think it’s safe to say that they don’t build ‘em like they used to. Any new building the state constructs clearly must be considered temporary quarters. For some reason, we seem to think that building new schools every generation will improve education, even when all evidence points in the opposite direction.
Although Westgate is a building constructed with no aesthetic considerations and is certainly not one of the city’s architectural treasures, it can be repaired and used indefinitely. The very idea that the building should be razed is ridiculous.
I know that the levy has been passed and the point is moot, but I sure wish the school district and the state would build a beautiful and impressive building downtown that we can all be proud for centuries to come, and then concentrate on delivering high quality education. It just seems very strange to me that no one has even considered that option.
- - -
As we might have expected, the last weeks of the presidential campaign will get ugly, especially with McCain-Palin slipping in the polls by the day. Sensing defeat, Republican campaign crowds are getting more aggressive and desperate. Unable to win on the issues, the big thing now for the Republican camp is that Obama is a terrorist and a “socialist.”
To reasonable people, the terrorist thing is little more than a pathetic appeal to fear. As for the socialist accusations, I wonder if any of these people even know what socialism is, especially in light of Sen. McCain’s recent plan for the federal government to buy up mortgages from individual citizens. And that’s on top of the administration-sponsored government bailout plan for failed banks. If this isn’t socialism, what is?
The fact is this country has been “socialist” for a long, long time, and neither political party can pretend to opt out. The new socialists, however, are the Republicans, who have worked very hard to turn the federal government into a gigantic money laundering scheme. Recent Republican administrations seem to be in a contest to outdo each other with record federal deficits—all in an effort to funnel taxpayer dollars into corporate coffers. As if that weren’t enough, McCain now wants the federal government to be your mortgage lender. This is a transparent, desperate move to make McCain appear like he cares about “Main Street,” and that’s all it is.
It also seems that inviting the dipshit “hockey mom” to the ticket has backfired. Instead of attracting women voters, Palin has alienated women, who are turning away from the Republican ticket in droves. In the final analysis, it will be women voters who send John McCain back to the Senate and Sarah Palin back to Alaska.
Obama? He’s a liberal Democrat whose basic political beliefs seem not to have changed much during the campaign. He has a base of hard-core supporters, yes, but most Americans will support him just because they’ve had all they can stand of these phony so-called “neo-con” Republicans, who have migrated so far from genuine American conservatism that they only reliable voting block left to them is a combination of xenophobes, racists, and evangelical Christians.
At this point, the best hope for Republicans is to make the last month of the campaign so filthy and disgusting that decent people will tune it out completely and refuse to vote. Or they can continue their attempt to inspire the crazies and hope one of them takes a shot at Obama. See Has Sarah Palin Put a Target on Obama?
I see in today’s Review a story about East Liverpool Board of Education member Janice Martin’s objection to a special meeting called by board president Gary Bonnell, but it’s not the details of that issue that interest me. What does interest me is the idea that any school building—in this case, Westgate—should be abandoned.
I guess I have more of a European sense about buildings—that is, if you have a good building, put your money into maintenance and repair rather than new construction. Wouldn’t it be great, for example, if the old Central School were still there and used. That building was one of the most impressive ever built in the city, yet it was abandoned and eventually knocked over without ceremony. Only after it was down did people get nostalgic and decide to build a little “replica” on the same spot.
The East Liverpool School District later abandoned the building that now houses part of Kent State University—a perfectly good building that’s currently in better condition than it was when it was new. And what did we get for it? A hideous modern building up on the hill constructed so poorly that it’s already falling apart. I won’t even get into the damage done to the city by the district removing all the students from the downtown.
When it comes to buildings, I think it’s safe to say that they don’t build ‘em like they used to. Any new building the state constructs clearly must be considered temporary quarters. For some reason, we seem to think that building new schools every generation will improve education, even when all evidence points in the opposite direction.
Although Westgate is a building constructed with no aesthetic considerations and is certainly not one of the city’s architectural treasures, it can be repaired and used indefinitely. The very idea that the building should be razed is ridiculous.
I know that the levy has been passed and the point is moot, but I sure wish the school district and the state would build a beautiful and impressive building downtown that we can all be proud for centuries to come, and then concentrate on delivering high quality education. It just seems very strange to me that no one has even considered that option.
- - -
As we might have expected, the last weeks of the presidential campaign will get ugly, especially with McCain-Palin slipping in the polls by the day. Sensing defeat, Republican campaign crowds are getting more aggressive and desperate. Unable to win on the issues, the big thing now for the Republican camp is that Obama is a terrorist and a “socialist.”
To reasonable people, the terrorist thing is little more than a pathetic appeal to fear. As for the socialist accusations, I wonder if any of these people even know what socialism is, especially in light of Sen. McCain’s recent plan for the federal government to buy up mortgages from individual citizens. And that’s on top of the administration-sponsored government bailout plan for failed banks. If this isn’t socialism, what is?
The fact is this country has been “socialist” for a long, long time, and neither political party can pretend to opt out. The new socialists, however, are the Republicans, who have worked very hard to turn the federal government into a gigantic money laundering scheme. Recent Republican administrations seem to be in a contest to outdo each other with record federal deficits—all in an effort to funnel taxpayer dollars into corporate coffers. As if that weren’t enough, McCain now wants the federal government to be your mortgage lender. This is a transparent, desperate move to make McCain appear like he cares about “Main Street,” and that’s all it is.
It also seems that inviting the dipshit “hockey mom” to the ticket has backfired. Instead of attracting women voters, Palin has alienated women, who are turning away from the Republican ticket in droves. In the final analysis, it will be women voters who send John McCain back to the Senate and Sarah Palin back to Alaska.
Obama? He’s a liberal Democrat whose basic political beliefs seem not to have changed much during the campaign. He has a base of hard-core supporters, yes, but most Americans will support him just because they’ve had all they can stand of these phony so-called “neo-con” Republicans, who have migrated so far from genuine American conservatism that they only reliable voting block left to them is a combination of xenophobes, racists, and evangelical Christians.
At this point, the best hope for Republicans is to make the last month of the campaign so filthy and disgusting that decent people will tune it out completely and refuse to vote. Or they can continue their attempt to inspire the crazies and hope one of them takes a shot at Obama. See Has Sarah Palin Put a Target on Obama?
posted by M. | 7:47 AM
29 Comments:
What you, Martin and Larry Walton don't seem to get: the Ohio School Facility Commission is the one that decides which buildings are worth keeping, not Gary Bonnell or "the people."
This decision was made how many years ago and now Martin, Walton and Halbert want to beat a dead horse, getting people all hopeful that it can and should be saved.
The idea of buying the WOHI building isn't a good one either but putting almost $300,000 into West Gate just to have it torn down is stupid, when the school district is finally getting ahead financially.
Renting space until the district gets the building project done and sees how much money is left sounds like a smart move. For once, Gary Bonnell is making some sense.
Sarah Palin is coming to St. Clairsville this weekend, Matt. You can go see her in person!
Someone please explain to me how a district can't afford to keep a streamlined Westgate when you're eliminating 2 1/2 buildings that are currently maintained -- Admin, East Elem. and 50 percent of Westgate -- as well as the cost savings from the renovated, higher-efficient HS, North and Lacroft. Sounds like one man's vendetta. He doesn't care about our future. Wake up people and take back your schools! Once Westgate is gone, its gone for good.
BTW, what will we do for space for students if enrollment changes (like its increased in the lower grades this year.) From what I understand, there is no room for 5th and 6th grades in Lacroft and North. Wouldn't keeping Westgate make sense? While not an architectural jewel, the gym and auditorium could never be replicated.
Why the rush to judgement to move the Admin offices so quickly? Or does the district now have so much money to waste that it can act prematurely. Let's see the building project through first before we make any rash decisions.
Just my $.02.
Well, my friends, it looks like the election will come down to what Missouri voters decide on Nov. 4. Just read a big AP story about how it's all coming down to the Show-Me State this season.
That means I'm part of the solution or the problem. One thing is for sure --- Obamanator is sure to come back to Independence; he was already here about a month ago, giving a speech about a quarter mile from my house. His wife was here, too, giving a public rally where everyone was invited --- the same day McCain was here, locking himself and 300 people, who had to be invited, in a dark, dark room.
If he comes again, my name is first on the list to cover the event for the paper. I even have the cell phone of one of his assistants who promised to get within smelling distance.
So, my friends, what would you like me to ask Obama? Maybe I should ask why McCain and his graddaughter are becoming such hate-spewing mongers; why Palin appears to WANT someone to assassinate him.
All this and Obama-man appears to be chilling out, taking it cool, focusing on the issues even though i'm sure some of those issues he promises will be axed. I ain't niave.
My prediction? Obama will win by a slim margain here in Missouri. I've been here long enough to know that the two major cities here are primarily Democratic, though those pesky paranoid Bible-thumpers out here in the limestone hills, the one that want no government but want the government to tell a woman what she can and can't do with her own body, tend to clog up the machine. The 6th Congressional race here in Mizzou land pits a former Kansas City Dem Mayor against a short angry little Republican whose only defense against her is that she raised taxes as a mayor (even though KC is enjoying a $6 billion investment wave) and that she was once a sex therapist.
The one advantage Dems have here is that the current Republican Governor has slashed the state's Medicare program and farming subsidies. That and he's a geek. Well, whatever, that's not deep. Guess I ran out of gas.
Sinde McRich is now in on the attacks. She made me want to vomit when I heard her little speech about how Obama would not fund the troops and her son and sniff, sniff. Of course her husband, grandpa Simpson voted no and also voted no on personal body armor...wonder if that gave her a chill? Of course she is rich enough to buy armour for the whole military. On another note, don't forget the christian get together in the Diamond Sat. for the laying on of hands to protect us from witchcraft. Just to be safe, bring a can of WITCH-BE-GONE so we can spray it on anyone that looks suspicious. Also, if you have any SPRAY A GAY-AWAY bring that with you. They seem to be everywhere!
Matt wrote. . .
Recent Republican administrations seem to be in a contest to outdo each other with record federal deficits—all in an effort to funnel taxpayer dollars into corporate coffers.
[end quote]
Religious coffers as well:
[excerpt]
** PRESS RELEASE ** PRESS RELEASE
You can view an HTML version of this email at the following address:
http://www.au.org/site/R?i=pJFEeaUqP77dFeLhheP6pA..
October 7, 2008
Americans United Blasts Bush Administration For Report Urging More Tax Aid
To Religious Schools
Keep Emphasis On Public Education, Says Church-State Watchdog Group
Americans United for Separation of Church and State today criticized the White House for issuing a report calling for massive new forms of tax funding of religious schools.
[end excerpt]
Matt Wrote. . .
I see in today’s Review a story about East Liverpool Board of Education member Janice Martin’s objection to a special meeting called by board president Gary Bonnell, but it’s not the details of that issue that interest me. What does interest me is the idea that any school building—in this case, Westgate—should be abandoned.
[end quote]
Such would be a shame, but probably can't be averted, It is sort of a statement they don't ever expect the enrollment in city schools to make any kind of substantial reversal, Which in turn implies the same for the city itself.
However, back to Westgate. I heard it being built (pile driving daily for weeks on end) Saw it being built and played in the structure as it was being built
I helped, along with a good many other kids, to open Westgate as I entered 8th grade its first year in
existence as a functioning school.
I went to 8th and 9th grades there.
I wonder if they will have a open house for the public to take a last look around before they begin to tear it down. I would hope so, I would like to walk through it one last time, stil up some old memories again.
See the gum that two other boys and I were entrusted by Mr Dixon, the Principle, to protect during lunch hour, i. e. keep others from using it as a short cut and walking across the gym floor in street shoes.
For us in those days, us being the ones who had attended the old neighborhood schools like 6th Street, a school build in the late 1800s, Westgate was a big deal in 1956. State of the art.
Dead horse--
Yes, now that the district has signed on to the OSFC building program, these issues are largely moot. I guess my position is an overall lament that we never seem to know what we've got 'til it's gone. The public schools built these days are expensive, ugly, and virtually always unnecessary.
Matt, it's not that I disagree with that. The old buildings are certainly beautiful but there is also to be taken into consideration the cost of heating/cooling Westgate compared to the other buildings.
I understand it is really much higher.
It's too bad all the buildings can't be saved, but that's unrealistic.
For the person to say this is a vendetta on Bonnell's part is unfair; he did sue to try and save Westgate as part of the project but lost. I don't know his reason for pushing the WOHI building but do believe him when he says he would like to save WG; he went to Charlie Wilson and the OSFC and begged for money to try and keep it, did any of the other board members do that? No, they're just trying to get the parents to say they want it but not giving any concrete solutions to HOW that can be done.
Sometimes, it is what it is and what it is is WG is history.
I think Bonnell has said in the papers he is not opposed to saving WG but the money isn't there. And also he has said this is not a permanent solution to lease the WOHI building, just a stopgap until "the dust settles" and the district sees where it is.
Maybe there WILL be enough money to renovate WG, but that's not yet known, apparently.
Who says the money isn't there to support Westgate? Bonnell? Maybe it is and maybe it isn't, but I don't like the rush to judgement. According to the OSFC, they will renovate Westgate if enrollment increase or stabilizes like it has this year. I just hate to commit to a 3-year lease and $70,000 in renovations while we wait a year and a half for the building project to be finished. Why can't the current Admin building be used with minor repairs? Or why can't the Admin use some of the empty classrooms at Westgate without the cost of the renovations. Can't our administration use the facility without luxury offices for one year? Why move so quickly and why right now? Why the need for an emergency meeting on a Saturday if you're not trying to get your agenda pushed down our throats? Again, just my $02.
Concerned Parent have you visited the administration building lately? It certainly is not luxury offices. To every one I have spoken to the people that work there are content with staying there until a more suitable place can be found. Certainly not the OLD WOHI building. Which I am pretty sure the paper said they would only be leasing not buying. Bonnell has said the administration building has to be vacated because of a study done and it isn't safe to be there? I think that is what I read in the papers. However, he wants to throw good money away to renovate a building they will only be leasing. How redundant! As the other board members and Mr. Halbert oppose him, it seems to me he is the only one wanting to make this move. Why does he get to decide what seems like many others don't want including the district employees. And I agree with you on that Saturday special meeting. Just trying to push something that was already decided on 4 days ago (not to his liking) with a so called special meeting then. How many special meetings can he call until he gets the answer he wants to here?
As Superintendent so inelegantly reminded Mr. Bonnell, he is but one board member.
The other ones also have a vote, and if the majority rules against leasing the WOHI building, then that's that.
If the majority votes to lease it, then apparently the majority feels it is the most viable solution.
It would require many hundreds of thousands to renovate the current admin building, which might be ok but why not wait until the building project is complete to see how much money is left?
Using unused space sounds like a good idea, IF there is any adequate space to use.
An architect hired by the board studied the issue and recommended the WOHI building. Why hire someone to make a study and a recommendation if you're going to ignore it? Talk about throwing money away...and the ENTIRE board voted to hire him.
I am trying to find the link to your email address Matt, but am not able to find it. Please post it.
Jeff M
If you get the chance to ask Obama a question, be sure to ask him if he has thought to stop by the post office and picked up a “change of address packet” so his mail can be forwarded to 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.
Else, he might not get his mail forwarded.
Sparky
Majority Rules, please be sure to check today's Review where Mr. Bonnell states that remodeling or rebuilding of any NON classroom space would have to come out of the pocket of the district and he also said with East Liverpool being in the fifth year of fiscal emergency spending money for that purpose would be unwise. Sooo, where is the money coming from to remodel the OLD WOHI building? And is Mr. Bonnell suggesting to spend this money unwisely? MMMM makes you think--what is his motive. Just to bully and get his own way. It seems most people are content staying where they are for the time being until a better solution can be found. And it is my understanding that the WOHI building is not even going to be adequate for the current needs of the Administration building anyhow. So, $70,000 plus will be spent on yet another empty building in East Liverpool lining yet anothers pockets and will still not be adequate. MMM people better wake up that Mr. Bonnell is not the saviour of the East Liverpool School District. The public really needs to get involved in what is going on behind the scenes and not just taking for granted what is being said on the street or in the newspapers.
two cents worth: Do you not realize that $70,000 is a LOT LESS than the $275,000 it would take to renovate WG JUST FOR ADMINISTRATION USE, not classrooms...and then it will be torn down.
It will take $500,000 to renovate the current admin building to proper standards.
Although renovating the WOHI building is also not a GOOD idea, it is probably the MOST ECONOMICALLY FEASIBLE...THAT'S the point.
I'd rather see $70,000 used from the general fund as a temporary measure than nearly $300,000 or $500,000.
For once, he's making some sense.
The districts build new buildings because they can get money from the state to do so. The state doesn't provide money for upgrading old buildings, but it does provide money for new construction. While it would be nice to keep those old schools, those old schools often weren't handicapped accessible, the wiring was old and would never be able to handle today's electrical needs, they don't meet current-day fire codes and they just aren't energy efficient.
The state finances new construction rather than retrofitting, so that the buildings meet all current-day codes from the beginning. And while many of us would love to keep the older buildings, if the state won't retrofit them, the local boards don't really have much choice.
Jeff M.
If you get a chance to ask Obama a question, ask if his administration will prosecute those responsible for this bailout, even if they are members of his own party.
Barney Frank and Chris Dodd are mentioned as knowing about this scheme and not doing anything about it.
Makes some sense: Here is what makes the most sense. Stay put until the dust settles and see where the most feasable place for the Administration Building is. Then spend the $70,000. It is my understanding the WOHI building is not going to hold all departments presently located at the Administration Building anyhow. Where are those people going to be placed and how much will it cost to relocate them? And where will that money come from? There are so many unanswered questions that Mr. Bonnell really doesn't give answers to.
I don't believe it can be said any better than this.
Matt,
Ted.com has code to embed the link below. I think it may be worth the time.
But who know about most of the Knuckelheads on here.
Enjoy,
http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/noah_feldman_says_politics_and_religion_are_technologies.html
I'm surprised Kent State wouldn't be interested in buying and remodeling Westgate. That would be one hell of an expansion for them and within pretty close distance to the campus. Maybe you could put a bug in someone's ear Matt.
And NOW the administrators weigh in (according to the paper). It seems they want their cake and eat it, too.
Either someone is lying about employees complaining of illness from working there or these employees have suddenly decided they don't care if they get sick.
For Larry Walton or anyone to cry foul when Bonnell asked to have these employees sign waivers agreeing not to sue over their illnesses is unfair.
Is he going to pay the bills when they all sue for getting sick? Doubtful.
If they all want to keep that building, then they all need to come up with some way to pay the cost of renovation. I know, how about they take a pay cut or cut in hours? Again, doubtful.
The OSFC WILL NOT pay to renovate these old buildings. The cost is coming from the general fund. The general fund is just now in good shape. Why spend it if not necessary?
Bonnell has said other space might become available down the road. Why not wait until then but get employees out of a "sick" building in the meantime?
And if it's not as bad as Halbert keeps saying it is, then just who the hell is telling the right story here?
"I'm surprised Kent State wouldn't be interested in buying and remodeling Westgate. That would be one hell of an expansion for them and within pretty close distance to the campus."
Maybe KSU has the $2-3 million it would take to renovate but the school district doesn't.
I think it's safe to say that Kent State has no use for or interest in the Westgate building. I'm not sure why it can no longer be used as a classroom building for E.L. district school children anymore. I assume it's because the district failed to maintain it properly. The word "fail" comes up way too much when it comes to our public schools.
I found the web site with the best political ad for president. If you like reading Matt's blog please go check it out. It is so funny.
http://www.tsgnet.com/pres.php?id=46832&altf=Nbuuifx&altl=Tufxbsu
"As the other board members and Mr. Halbert oppose him, it seems to me he is the only one wanting to make this move."
FYI: It was MR HALBERT who insisted the current administration building be vacated. He reported on it months ago and is among those who have been complaining that he has been made sick from it. It was not Gary Bonnell who brought up the subject of leaving the building.
As for why Westgate is to be demolished: that is part of the OSFC project; THE board (including JAnice Martin and Larry Walton) VOTED UNANIMOUSLY for "Option 5" which calls for demolition of Westgate School. NOw all of a sudden Martin and Walton want to save it. A little too late for that.
The reason it's not being saved is it's the largest building, hardest to heat, least convenient to the rest of the remodeled school buildings and VERY EXPENSIVE to renovate.
Surely, the OSFC which does these projects all around the state knows a tad bit more about what can be done and what can't be done to save buildings than a cameraman and a former school teacher, for God's sake.
The OSFC intends to renovate another building for classroom space if it'sneeded but right now the enrollment is going down so fast they'll be lucky to need the buildings that are being renovated.
The democrats don't want any personal attacks because it'll expose the Obamanation. Grampa McCain is obliging them as if it were scripted.
Decent people = any one who isn't a christion, anyone who made themselves into a good person by doing the right thing, by listening to the television and going with the 'mob rules', by seeing which way the wind was blowing this morning, by not being conservative, everything is relative,thats why murdering millions of inconvienient people will be necesary in the future, cause its all in how you look at things, ya know.........well do ya?.... it's just good intentions, it's the right thing to do for the greater good, its the decent thing to do .........
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